I don't remember what i said, you know me and my memory, I meant it though I'm sure.

"I didn't fight back against rape because God wanted me to bear that cross."

Is all this religious nonsense so thick for you that you people can't see the problem with her logic?

Does a woman who chooses to stay with her abusive husband when she could simply leave him and find a man who respects her really smell of liberation to you?

This whole thing has "Look at me, I'm such a saintly martyr" written all over it when it reality, she is nothing more than a poster-child for world's easiest divorce. Her own church says they're candidates for it so she doesn't have to tarnish her precious soul.

Michelle,

One question: Is your anger at me a product of your own divorce?

I'm willing to bet every cent I have on it.

I wish you peace.

If I admit to a divorce, you'll point and blame my argument on bitter feelings. If I say no, you'll just say I'm lying because there's no way to prove one way or the other.

I wish you common sense.

@Michelle-

Please share where you pulled your quote about not fighting off rape...I could find it nowhere in this discussion. Gina mentioned that even a child concieved through the heinous act of rape would still be deserving of life, but I have yet to see any sort of condoning of the act. Violence towards women is an entirely different discussion, well worth having, but not at issue here.
Also not at issue is the decision of a woman to remain with an abusive spouse. I believe the author has taken great pains to point out that her husband is in fact NOT abusive, and is in many other regards a caring, devoted spouse and loving father. Do you keep a stash of those on hand when one doesn't work out for you? If so, please share, I know of a few good women who'd appreciate the info! Lastly, and for the record, the Catholic Church does not advocate divorce, any more that it advocates abuse, misogyny, rape, abortion, or any other aspect downtrodden women. It is one of the few religions where the GREATEST respect for women is to be found.

I don't take contraception, Chux. He does.

Though if I were to get pregnant through some miracle, I fully expect he'd adjust nicely. Heh.

This is my only question. If the Church teaches that contraception is a sin in the marital relationship and Gina is going along with it, is not her husband causing her to sin? I find this very interesting. Protestants believe in submitting to your husband as he submits to God. One cannot happen without the other. I would definitely feel a bit wary of consenting to sin. If that is what it is.

I'm in tears for you...and I will pray for your situation...the only advise I can give you is to fast for your husband so that the Lord softens his heart...<3 HUGS

Gina, I found this post because you linked up to the Catholic Blogger's Network: http://www.catholicbloggersnetwork.com/p/weekly-round-up.html

I can not imagine how difficult it must be for you to know that your husband persists in the state of mortal sin by practicing contraception (or abuse of NFP). I would strongly urge you to help him to see the grave disservice he is doing to both you and your marriage by engaging in these actions. I hope you have a good priest who will hold him accountable for his actions. It is admirable for you to love your husband, however when his actions threaten his immortal soul, your role lies in doing everything in your power to avert that eternal consequence which is actions warrant. I know you probably won't post this but from one wife to another, you are enabling his sin if you don't act, so please do everything you can to help him to see the sin in what he is doing.

I have to agree with you. I feel that as a fellow Catholic, you cannot put your vow before the God-given rules of the Church. I was in a similar situation, but my husband was abusive and an addict. I tried everything to get him in a good place, but eventually, I realized the harm to my children and myself, in doing so. I pray that something happens soon for him to realize that his actions are putting your soul in danger. God bless!

My heart breaks for you - I know this pain. My first relationship ended badly after a late term stillbirth and a daughter, who at the time was 18 months old. After numerous dating failures I met the man of my dreams whom I've now married - he loved my daughter like she was his own, loved me unconditionally, respected me like no man ever had. I realised he was someone that I, that we, could grow with.

However, he didn't want a child of his own and was perfectly happy to just be dad to my daughter. I was devastated - I always wanted his child, from the moment I laid eyes on him, and I could *see* this baby, I swear it - it felt to me as though he was denying this real child of ours life. It felt like a rejection of me, me as a person, a mother, a partner, that he didn't want me to bear his children.

I'd made an uneasy peace with the fact we'd have only one child and I resolved myself to the fact, like you have, that I loved him absolutely and that he was the man I wanted by my side forever, children or not. I hesitate to say it, but we ended up with a surprise baby, due very soon. I didn't trick him - it happened in the most absurd of circumstances. I believe I was bedridden with the flu. I guess in some way, this child decided it wanted to be born. My husband is now excited at the prospect of imminent fatherhood - his fears, mainly financial, are still there, but he's seen the bigger picture. I'll keep hoping, for you, that your children too find a way to be born. If not though, I wish you courage, peace and healing, and a lifetime bond of love that will fill your life long after your son and perhaps grandchildren have made lives for themselves.

Wow!
I'm sorry if this is too personal, but didn't you talk about family size prior to marriage? Didn't the Priest ask? Does your husband realize he is breaking your marriage vows by not accepting children? (There is not a limit.)
I have a hard time believing your husband knows and understands your feelings on the matter as well as believing your love for him. Love is about sacrafice. Unfortunately it sounds as though he is being molded into a world of worrying about himself first, while completely dismissing your feelings and desires as his wife.
May I suggest talking to an Orthodox Priest on the matter. I cannot see your marriage not taking a lot of heat from the matter. Maybe not now, but when you have to actually realize that your dreams are over. That will hurt far worse than simply assuming he won't budge. Many prayers!

I would hope they reveal my sense of humor. :) Anything else is a stretch.

Though I'm tempted to put the "Ha's" here, I'll refrain for your benefit. ;)

If you feel like John was meant to be your husband, then it is your job to pray and suffer for his holiness in spite of his weakness. And which of us has fully acheived holiness? Turn to St. Joseph.

We see what sacrifice you are making, but exactly what is the sacrifice your husband is making? He sees that this is something dear to your heart and is in fact causing you great emotional pain and yet, unless he 'flips the switch' on his desire to have children, your pain is not important enough to him for him to give you your heart's desire? Does he honestly think he would not love another child of your union? Marriage is about self-sacrifice and sometimes doing things you don't necessarily want to because you love someone. Where and what is his sacrifice?

What is it that changed your husband's mind? What is he so afraid of or uncomfortable with about having more children?
Are his feelings about this something he is willing to explore in counceling?

I'll be praying for you. That seems like a very difficult cross to carry (and difficult one to share, you brave woman!). Your husband may change his mind.

Your post was very moving. There is NOTHING and I mean NOTHING that God can't do....So pray, pray hard, fast, pray the divine mercy chaplet and rosary that your husband has a change of heart. You may be very surprised to find that God moves him. It may take time, patience and lots of prayer on your part but I think God just might soften him up and change his mind. ;-) You, your husband and family will all be in my prayers from now on. God Bless!!! Natalie

"Reading through all the comments, I don't see your husband as heartless or selfish. I see him abiding by the principles in which he believes and that you knew when you decided to marry a non-Christian."

Yeah that's fine, Anna, but heck what about her? HE married a Catholic...shouldn't he think of her feelings too?

Why do his desires trump yours? What reasons for not having more children does he have that are so important that they warrant this sort of sacrifice and suffering on your behalf? Money? Freedom? You say that his reasons are valid and that he wishes he could just flip a switch and feel differently about it all, but the truth is that adults everyday choose to do things that they don't *feel* like doing. He can still choose this, even if he doesn't feel it. It must be very hard to be a devoted Catholic in a sacramental marriage with a person who does not even believe in God. I truly admire your love for your husband and for Christ. Your family is in my prayers.

Dear Gina,
First, thank you so much for your post. This was shared with me by a good Catholic friend of mine (I'm Protestant). She knows my pain - it's very much like yours. My husband and I have one child - I want more and he doesn't. I also identify with the part of your story that my husband and I are meant to be together, to love one another (real love - not loving only when it suits me), in spite of the various painful situations we find ourselves in in this life (and there are plenty, being human and all). What bothers me about some of the responses you've gotten is that people seem to be chastizing you for not getting what you want, not manipulating your husband through religious guilt to get what you want, etc. It just seems like the epitome of American "me, me, me" culture - using your vulnerability and pain to justify manipulating another beloved person into getting what you want. I have accepted my husband's feelings and position - and it has made out marriage stronger. We may adopt or foster a child some day, if God sees fit.

I pray for those folks who encourage you to step out of your relationship with your husband - that's not helpful at all. I do pray that others will come to see the truth of sacrifice - this life is really not about us (though we are part of it). It's about God and what God is up to all around us - and sometimes that includes emptiness, loss, lack, suffering. That's the path of redemption and resurrection - through suffering and death. The gift we have is that we get to rise with Christ. We are Easter/Resurrected people. And thanks be to God for that.

Along the lines of Celeste's comment, I think your desire to love and sacrifice for your husband in this area and to be an example of Christian charity constitutes a serious, and clearly heart-rending, reason to avoid pregnancy--but I do hope and pray that you do so by licit means (NFP). My parents divorced several years ago, and I believe one of the contributing factors was that my dad was not Catholic and they were using contraception. Even on a natural level, contraception drives a wedge between a couple--and for those who are Catholic, the guilt of committing a sin with every marital act is very damaging. I don't mean to preach, but it really is a matter of conscience for you to refuse to use artificial contraception, as a tenet of the faith, and not something you can sacrifice for your husband's sake. Sin is not a sacrifice.

I found your post through a share on Google+, so it's spreading fast! :) God bless!

Gina,

I am terribly sorry for your pain, not just as a wife, but as a mother, for your child, and for your husband. Your family will be in my prayers. I sympathize greatly as my family has had serious reasons to postpone expanding our family, even though we all want more children as well. That desire and concern of yours is very real.

While I read through your post, I haven't read through every comment, so I apologize if I'm bringing up points that others have already made, and I hope to that point I don't frustrate you.

However, here are my points that I make with great humility and love:

1. You mention that you don't want your children to be conceived in anything less than unconditional love. I will challenge you in expanding your comfort zone since it's not immoral for children to be conceived within a marriage in less than perfect circumstances. In fact, there can be great grace won through this humility, both between spouses and for the children. In bringing up the Holy Family, I want to remind you that Saint Joseph was VERY reluctant to take Mary has his wife upon hearing about her pregnancy, and he actually considered leaving her because of societal shame, doubt, etc. An angel had to appear to him to basically say, "Not a good idea." Wouldn't it be lovely for an angel to appear to your husband??? Anyway, we can pray for those miracles, but we also have to accept that maybe our way, and in this case, your way of wanting every child to be planned and conceived in unconditional love, that maybe God is challenging you to expand this definition unconditional love. After all, as humans, we are all imperfect lovers. In fact, many parents express that sentiment that their love for their spouse and child grow over time. If you experienced this yourself, and your husband has, too, then how can you say you can't have a kid until you've developed the love first? If God can work with us on a mustard seed of faith, then maybe you need to let go of your expectations and accept your husband's mustard seed of love. Even if you have judged that his love is not "unconditional" but he's giving you a mustard seed of love in the direction of expanding the family, then take it! And cherish it.

2. Taking contraceptives is against Catholic teaching, see the Catechism, and JP II's writings on Humane Vitae. Forcing a spouse to take contraceptives is immoral and sinful behavior. You have the right to stand up for your own dignity and demand that love and respect from your husband. You actually have a responsibility to God to do so. When God entrusts lives in our care, such as children (or spouses), we would think nothing of defending their lives, their dignity. Well, God also expects that we do the same for ourselves, that we ensure that no one treads on our dignity as persons, or objectifies us and uses us for sexual gratification. You have every right to say to your husband, "I love you, but I cannot participate in this sin with you. If you choose to get a vestecomy,or continue with other contraceptives, then you're choosing to remain celibate, for I will not have sex with you and participate in the sin since it's violating my dignity, morals, and Catholic teaching." Sex in this scenario of using contraceptives becomes destructive, not unitive. It won't bring you graces, for sin can never bring you graces, but quite the opposite, it will pull you away from your husband and from God. These are your choices. Discernment will tell you if you're making choices out of the best spiritual welfare of your marriage and family, or if you're making them out of fear of rejection, fear of the unknown, etc. However, there is never the excuse for sin. We will all fall short of God's grace from time to time, and thank God for the merciful gift of confession! Prayer will tell you what virtues you need to be strengthened in, what vices you need to overcome, how your situation in life best challenges you to do so. God gave us free will so that we can make these choices. You have the right to stop your husband in his unloving actions towards you. No one is forcing your hand in anything. If we acquiesce to evil, then we are participating in evil, and I venture to say that deep in your heart, you know this is what is causing the greatest turmoil. These are not easy things to hear, I know. And if you need more clarifying information in the ethics of these choices in regards to contraception, I encourage you to contact the Pope Paul VI Institute--Sister Renee Merkes is wonderful to talk to about these subject matters in regard to spiritual direction and ethical dilemmas, and most assuredly will phrase these things and express herself in a much better way than I ever could.

Out of genuine love and respect for you as my sister in Christ, I urge you to contact the Pope Paul VI institute for more information. They also teach a natural family planning method called the Creighton method. Even if there are le

Gina,
James agrees with you on this- you are not he one contracepting, and thus are not sinning. The marital act is two-fold; for unity of spouses and to be open to life. You, by your non-contraceptive nature, and your vocal desire for children are upholding your theological side, and are participating to stregthen your unity with John. Just wanted to bolster you up on that score. St. Monica's one of my favs, and am praying for you guys on this :-)

Gina, I absolutely and whole-heartedly COMMEND you for taking such a risk and posting such a deep sentiment of suffering on cyberspace, where people feel they can judge, hate, and condemn you easily because they are not standing right in front of your tear-stained face. That is the unfortunate thing about the internet... however, it is also fortunate, because people like me can get to meet people like you! ;)

Your post is so beautiful because it is so real. It is not fluffy, glossy, look-at-my-perfect-marriage-and-17-perfect-kids-that-I-homeschool type of stuff... (which I find rather boring, because I know it's fake anyway. ;)

A word of encouragement: when people are angry or upset, that is a good sign... it means something is stirring in their conscience, and you tapped into it. They don't hate you or your post; they are wrestling (or trying to avoid wrestling) with something within themselves. Just know that when they are harsh in judgment, they obviously haven't walked in your shoes. It's kind of like when I have turned up in the ER with a severe migraine and a nurse who's never had one says 'have you tried getting some rest and blocking the light from your room?' while I am vomitting on the floor from pain... Gee, no, I hadn't thought of that! LOL! The nurse who has had them doesn't offer silly comments like that. She administers an IV right away and gets me comfortable... It's like this with many other things in life. All the NFP suggestions (and I'm an NFP user) are from people who are blessed with a spouse who goes for that. I am blessed with one of those. I am also blessed with 8 children. But I would never presume that you and I have the same blessings. Or crosses. We all have a unique relationship with God and unique way to get to heaven. I am blessed with a Catholic husband. But that does not mean I don't suffer with deep OTHER crosses that don't have to do with our faith... crosses that make me sometimes not want to get up in the morning. Crosses that tempt me to give up on my marriage.

It all comes down to: NONE, and I mean NONE of us can judge another's heart. Most people mean well, I am sure, even those that are overly critical. But those of us who are not suffering the same cross (which you are bearing so gracefully) simply need to be grateful for our own blessings... and we need to BUILD YOU AND YOUR HUBBY UP!!! I am not saying condoning sin... but from your postings, I can see that you have already communicated your wishes and desires... and you are a person of prayer and a seeker of truth and purity. This is a case where we need a miracle.

And, my guess is that many MANY women suffer with these types of struggles, but don't share them. There is another side to the story... the hubby that wants 20 kids when the wife is about to collapse. And she obeys... just like you do in your situation... What is sad to me is when she or anyone pretends that all is peachy. It is not. Life, and especially the Catholic life, is nitty gritty, like the cross and the dirty apostles. It's not so squeaky perfect. For ANY of us, even the fakers out there who seem to be floating in the clouds of perfection ;)

Please keep up the good and holy work... I think your blog made 'headlines' for a reason. And I can't wait to read more!

One more thing: that son of yours is absolutely ADORABLE. ;)

Love,
shalimamma at www.LifeVictorious.com

Hugs to you, too, Gina!

I feel SO BLESSED to have found you!! I had a thought when I woke up this morning... I think your post is inspired because now prayers will be coming from all over the place for you and your beautiful family... I am expecting a miracle! And also, now other women (and men) will also perhaps feel free to share or admit or pray for their own situations. God is using you!!

And, in other news... you're on 'the air' this morning at LifeVictorious.com:

http://lifevictorious.wordpress.com/2012/04/28/my-broken-fiat-faithfulness-when-things-arent-so-squeaky-clean/

;)

Love, and a thousand blessings to you,
shalimamma

I'd like to know if your husband has read this. I saw you said he doesn't have to because you're open (and that's great), but there's something very powerfula bout what you've written here. Maybe you should have him read it.

You said you've done Marriage Encounter, so think of this as a dialogue starter. Heck, my wife and I used it ourselves this weekend. Great for discussing vulnerability, selfishness vs. sacrifice, empathy, and even the veil of anonymity (with how some people have taken liberties to harshly question you just because you posted this online).

We thank you for your bravery and gentle insight. We'll be praying for you. Please keep us updated on how things go. With all these prayers, we're expecting a miracle!

I hope you don't mind, but I'd like to direct you and your readers to this site for a reflection on contraceptives. I think it'd be very useful for this entire debate. Prayers for you.

http://www.catholicsistas.com/2012/04/24/why-contraception-will-never-be-permitted/

Thanks, Thadeus. That's very sweet! I appreciate your well-wishes. Please know I return the same to you and yours!

<3

ur tagged on reddit

I'm truly sorry for your pain and know it must be a rough road you've traveled down thus far. I adore how respectful you are of your husbands wants and don't discredit them as any less valid then your own.

A thing that I noticed was that you are telling people 'some day' and then looking at your husband outside while his conversations with the men are different. I ask why don't you tell them "We've decided that we will not have any more children." To me it would prove to show that you are both unified in this family decision. Which I can certainly understand hurts you, but to me it just makes things worse by saying 'some day'. I know you don't want to 'out' him and you don't have to if your present it to family members (provided you want to share with them) as a unified front that you both will not have any more children.

I also do not thing that this is something that you should have to carry by yourself. Being married means you go through things together arm, in arm. I hope he's very sensitive to the heartache this topic brings you. I also think that perhaps counseling may help you both. With something as 'big' as this it's hard to 'fix' things yourself. Counseling would provide you both with an open forum where perhaps you can both gain tools to help you cope and to ensure this doesn't affect your marriage in the furutre. Harboring pain such as what you wrote can only really build, it shouldn't be something that you should have to feel for the rest of your life. At one point there will be acceptance (from one of you).

I wish you both all the best and admire your strength but also your husbands for being so open and honest with you. That to me is such an amazing attribute and speaks volumes about the relationship the two of you have together.

Helloooooo! ;)

I needed to weigh in on this particular comment...

Gina, I wholeheartedly agree with you. My hubby and I probaby SHOULD have gotten therapy for OUR darkest secret which I haven't written about yet on my blog (oooooh... something exciting to come!) but we were actually advised not to. We tried Marriage Encounter, too. I communicate TONS. I am a steam kettle. Hubby: not so much. But even with only ONE of us communicating lots we still worked out HUGE problems. I do think therapy works for some people... But I have become convinced that all that 'talking and chatting about every emotion' (aka, would you say your anger is like a shade of red, or more like pink?' Lol!) is NOT necessarily so manly... again... just my experience with my man... and we have come through some major difficulties parallel to Gina's.

I also have 4 boys (in addition to my 4 girls) and I don't want to raise up pansies. When they are frustrated, I have them go throw something outside or go run or go dig a hole. Do we need to explore every inner emotion? They're baffled by it anyway, and we women are much more gifted in that area. My 3 year old daughter knows more about her feelings than any of my boys combined with their father, all together. Of course, boys need to learn compassion, forgiveness, and kindness (which is honorable), and my boys cry at times. My hubby will get a tear in his eye when he sees our baby or somthing touches his heart (SO sweet). But we don't have hours long talks about feelings anymore. When I tried this with my hubby (for YEARS) it frustrated both of us. Now we talk for hours sometimes, but we don't go on and on like we're at a couselling session, and both of us come to good conclusions (most of the time ;)

Gina, your relationship with your hubby is leaps and bounds ahead of many, probably even mine and my hubby's. I love that you both communicate so much. That is amazing. I think in our society we can overcomplicate things. Some things are CROSSES and we can't cure them (especially if we want to become a saint.) Please remind me of this when I hit my next road block. Lol. But seriously, it is true, and something I have needed to accept. I wanted to 'solve all of my hubby's flaws' and even all of my own, when I realized that life in holiness is actually not like that. It's not so squeaky clean. It's messy, but simple really. This is the cross God chose for you right now, and He (and Our Lady) are helping you bear it. God chooses funky crosses sometimes that make me throw my hands up and go "WT...???!!!" But in the end I go, Ok Ok... Here I am, Lord.

I kick and scream all the way of course, but nobody ever said you needed to skip and whistle while bearing a cross ;)

Love and hugs, Gina,
Shalimamma

OMGawd with the therapy already! WTF is it with women and this need for therapy for everything? Doesn't enyone know how to take care of their own problems anymore? Dayum! Stop watching Housewives of NY, OC or Whinesville and you might figure out that you can solve things without doctors, lipo or alcohol. GAWWWD!

Sorry, but Lauren, you crack me up. I am going to use "Dayum" in a future writing... Lol! (For the record, I love alcohol, and need lipo... but my favorite therapy is chocolate. ;)

Ha ha ha - oh my goodness, don't feed the trolls, Shalimamma!!!

*Grin*

Lauren's favorite therapy involves 80's memorabilia. She's just testy because not everyone finds the soothing sounds of Milli Vanilli to conquer all problems of the heart. ;)

Let's leave my potty mouth out of this. *blush* Though I think I might have to adopt the term "pirate mouth."

Oh Gina! Hugs!

You are handling all of this so gracefully! I can't even imagine how not sacrificially I would be handling this situation (but I know it wouldn't be pretty!).

Maybe... if Vincent ends up being called to the vocation of marriage... he'll be like me. I am basically an only child (my mom's only. I have a half sister who's 11 years older who moved out when I was in preschool.) and that is very much is a key part of what led me to want a large family (although in the beginning the idea of even one was pretty scary for me too!).

And prayers that this is something that changes over the years (or better yet much, much sooner) for your DH. You're an amazing wife doing something that, as the negative commenters can attest to, is uncommon and beautifully sacrificial in our self centered culture.

p.s. I found you through a Google+ post as I was attempting to catch up over there.

Hi Ashley,

Congratulations on your pregnancy. I wish you all the best! How far along are you (if you don't mind my asking)?

This sort of decision really is tough, so you and your husband will be kept in my prayers. I'm glad you gained something from both the blog and the commentary. I really am. Thank you for such sweet feedback.

Also, which blog site directed you here? I always like to send a "thanks" to anyone who felt my entries were worthwhile enough to pass along. It's much appreciated.

Blessings to you, your husband, and your little one. :)

Nutties are always welcome here. Ha ha.

Gina- thanks for such honest sharing. I will certainly keep you in my prayers and your comments have helped me to be more sensitive to our Churches teachings and how difficult the situation can be for husband and wife.

I get that I posted this publicly. I get that opens me up to criticism. I even get that some folks, like yourself, attempt to provide that criticism with the best of intentions.

However, here are some things you might not be privy to, which ends up making your 'read' on the situation incredibly wrong.

1. Yes, this is a public blog. However, until this entry found itself on Facebook, my traffic was around 80 hits per day. I felt relatively safe that my blog was a personal, semi-private diary that was only shared amongst a small circle of people who shared a similar mind-set.

Now that my traffic is upwards of a thousand hits per day (still not huge, but WAY more than I'd ever anticipated this blog seeing), I can understand why you'd want to caution me against leaving this up if it'd confuse others.

That brings me to point number 2.


2. It shouldn't confuse anyone, but if it does, I hope it's for the best. My entry wasn't meant to direct anyone to or away from annulment. I could write a "how to" or "about" entry any day. This was a PERSONAL EXPERIENCE that I wrote out because I needed a therapeutic release. It wasn't meant as an educational tool. It wasn't meant as a "how to" manual. It was a personal expression of a very personal experience. I've never stated (here or elsewhere) that my situation could - in ANY way - be applied to anyone else (even if their situation held similarities to mine).

Thus, why would I remove something that does not confuse Catholic morality? If anything, my response to this situation falls 120% in line with Catholic teaching on marriage. So if it confuses you, might I suggest a refresher course on the vows of Sacramental Marriage?


3. I make no claims to be a pious Catholic. However, that's a typical claim from folks. Why? I think it's because of a personal reaction to whatever was read.

Example:

When Bob sees Sally act in a manner that forces him to question his OWN behaviors, instead of following that self-reflection through, he turns on Sally who served as catalyst for his self-reflection. Instead of accepting the possibility that maybe, just maybe, there was a better course of action, he angrily stamps his foot and complains that Sally was simply acting in an exaggeratedly moral way (meaning Sally's action wasn't really moral so much as a facade of moral).

This relinquishes Bob's responsibility to own up to the possibility that, when faced with a similar situation, he may not have chosen the best response.


4. My husband is NOT emotionally abusive. I've explained this in countless ways over three other entries. Doubtful you'll come back to read this let alone read my other responses, but if ever you do stumble your way back here, feel free to peruse.


5. I don't appreciate the insinuations you haphazardly made, and I don't appreciate you attempting to make this entry into something it's not.

Feel free to fire off a disgusted e-mail to your friend and all others who have read this entry. I honestly hope they come back here and read my response to your allegations so that any confusion YOU brought to them can be allayed.

I would have sent you this message privately, but you left no e-mail with which to contact you. So I apologize that this had to be public, but I was left no real recourse. I didn't want to just delete the comment because you brought up points that others might've thought of as well. It's fine to hold opinions that differ, and it's even fine to think I'm out of my mind for my response to this situation.

It's NOT okay, however, to falsely accuse me of leading others astray, to accuse my husband of being abusive, and then to suggest I remove content from my own site...

Pardon me, but common sense dictates you're well out of line.

{hugs}

I really have no words.

(In wonder) My goodness, aren't you judgmental. We don't always get what we want in this life, or in our marriages, but that certainly doesn't mean that we're necessarily being abused. Nor does it mean that we're being passive-aggressive when we dare to share our pain on the fact, and it most CERTAINLY doesn't qualify us to divorce ourselves from the situation just because it's not what we thought we signed up for. If that were the case, that 50 percent marital failure rate would rank in at a hundred, and the word 'commitment' might as well be erased from the vocabulary of humanity altogether, never mind the words 'prayer' and 'miracles.'

We Catholics go into marriage with the hope of, and the avowal to be, a means of our partner's salvation - and none of us come to heaven by means of the wide and easy road. If we all married only perfect people, the species would have died out as soon as it began. To give up on each other because of our imperfections and fears is to give up, too, on the Presence of God in each other, and yes, on God Himself. Who knows what graces will be birthed from these struggles between John and Gina? No one knows but God, as of yet, and as they were made one on their wedding day, as long as one of them is with Him, He is with them both.

The term for a post like this is, I believe,

"PWNED"

I think you are very brave and I understand the pain you are in. We had to make the decision to let our homestudy lapse and after we made the decision (and if came just a couple weeks after our oldest daughter ran away and was missing for days) I started to regret it, but my husband absolutely does not want more children while our oldest is still at home. This means that by the time she's out of the home, I will be over 35 and don't feel it would be responsible to TRY to get pregnant, so likely I will never experience a pregnancy. Although I feel lucky that I don't have to wade into the contraception debate with him, because we would need medications to GET pregnant rather than NOT to get pregnant.

So I do feel your pain, and I'm glad I'm not alone...

Different Kelli, same thread!

Also know Jeannie, and I wanted to toss in my two cents regarding this (we've been talking about it for a couple days now).

As a divorced woman who struggled with the emotional abuse of an overbearing husband, I think she's just prone to bristle at the thought of another woman enduring what she did. As you mentioned, I think she was trying to be charitable in her comments (even though I agree they came off too harshly in judgement of you and your husband).

I happened to really like this entry, too, and was wondering if you ever did a follow-up of your hsuband's reasons like you mentioned you might. I saw your follow up entries, but I couldn't see that one. Wasn't sure if you did it or not.

K - won't take up more time, but wanted to thank you for this, too, and explain a little why Jeannie said what she said. I'm not condoning it, but it helps to have perspective.

Also from KA's thread!

Loved this entry and am pretty interested in your other ones, too. I'm not catholic, but I dabble in the various christian theologies because I believe them to at least be working towards the truth, ya know?

Just wanted to add that I enjoyed this and was deepely moved by it. Glad he's not an emotionally abusive a-hole. That's the important thing!

Great witness,


I am in the same position except my wife takes birth control. She knows how it make me furious, but doens't want any more children. I have tried to explain catholic doctrine, and Humanae Vitae, but she refuses to acknowledge. She was born into a catholic family and recieved her sacraments(baptism +confirmation, overseas diocese) but her family pursued Jehovah Witness as she grew older. She believes that God has abandoned her. So she doesn't come to church with me, and our children.

Yet I still pray a rosary for her everyday, that God will touch her heart and come back. I do wish her and I could have more children. We have two girls. Keep your head up, Saint Monica prayed for years for her son, we must do the same for our loved ones.

Lorenzo - you have my prayers as well. Susan, what a organization!!! Thanks for posting it out there not just for Lorenzo, but for all of us who struggle and need the prayers.

May you both feel the smile of Our Lady in your lives. <3

{Hugs}

I'm honestly learning that through the spread of this entry. It is truly my hope that this now reaches out to those who struggle with a similar issue. There is hope and love and healing available to couples who struggle with this. There really is.

Blessings and prayers to you for your sweet response. Thank you. <3

Hello Gina,
I was introduced to your blog from spiritdaily.org. I admire you so very much for sharing how you feel. As a 36 y/o, single male Catholic, it is wonderful to hear that there are still devout Catholic women in the world, now I just need to find one that is single, lol !(the ones I have dated especially recently, though Catholic, are completely secular).
I have always wanted children....when I hear of a married father not wanting more it makes me wonder....am I out of my mind? When I was in Seminary, I thought could devout my life to the Church as a priest.....but the desire for a loving wife and children changed my mind. As I eluded to above the challenge of meeting someone is much tougher than I anticipated....regardless, (im getting a bit off topic, sorry) Pls allow me to recommend a series of books to you. "fatherless", "motherless", and "childless" written by Brian J. Gail. A priest friend of mine recommend the books. I just finished "fatherless"....its a pretty good and a worthwhile read and touches on the broader issue of artificial contraception.
I will pray for you, your husband and all Catholic couples. I am sure you are not alone....

*Sigh*

Marianna, please actually read my commentary before making sweeping allegations about the sinfulness of my soul, okay?

Last time I checked, your name was Marianna, not Jesus Christ. You cannot say that I'm living in mortal sin, and you certainly cannot tell me that I'm standing between God and husband through following the blessing of two separate priests.

Methinks they'd have a stronger handle on the theological ramifications than you.

So bless you and bless your children. However, I suggest withholding judgement over another person's soul, especially when you haven't a full grasp of the situation.

I feel for you as you are suffering the lack of fulfilling your natural desires to mother children. Not knowing the details of your situation it is hard to comment as I am not sure if you are using NFP which is legitimate or if you are using illigitimate birth control methods. If they are illigitimate, perhaps you should stop and demand to use NFP since otherwise you may be sinning by participating in the sin of spilling the seed or the blocking of the gift of life inherent in the sexual act. Assuming that you are using legitimate means, I feel for you and pray that in time, your husbands heart may be softened to using his life on earth giving of himself more completely. By posting this publicly you are going to receive a multitude of prayers on your behalf.

Bless you, Gerry. I honestly needed to read your comment right then and there. God was gracious to send you over. His timing is perfect.

<3

Gina,
I saw a link on Spiritdaily.com and thought I would check your site out. The situation you are in is a tough and delicate one. I commend you for sticking by your husband's side in this matter and not running for someone that will "fulfill" your needs. Too many people in today's world run at the first sign of trouble and if they are asked to sacrifice for one another.
I cannot sit here and judge your husband's motives for not having any more kids. I have never walked in his shoes and do not know his mind. While his using contraception is not right, I can only judge the action and not the person.
I pray that the Holy Spirit continues to strengthen the bond you two have as husband and wife. I pray that God's will be done and that both of you are open to the answers that he gives to your prayers. It's hard when God says "no" to our prayers but he says "no" because what we want might hurt us or he has decided that he has something so much better in store for us, if we would only wait -- and waiting/patience is not a strong suit for many of us.
May God bless you, your husband, your son and all your family and friends that support you. May he even bless those that are mean to you (and I've read some of their posts) and I pray that he turns their hearts from stone to compassion and help them understand it is never ok to hate the sinner (as we all are) - Christ commanded that we love everyone if their ways of doing things are different than ours. God Bless

Robert....perfectly said.

I would suggest that both you and your husband find as much information about Pope John Paul IIs Theology of the Body as you can. Find some seminars you could attend as well. This teaching explains the spousal meaning of the body from the word of God....It makes clear what marriage is all about. We have lost that meaning in our anti-procreative culture.

I wholeheartly agree with Mike. I have suffered through this my whole marriage. When I married I was not a practicing Catholic. I had a conversion two years later after my first born. My husband was really no religion. We had our second child six years later, we almost divorce during that time. I was too religious for him. I can't tell you how many prayers, tears, holy hours, and fasting that I have done over the years over this issue. My question for many of priests was this, is it ok to cooperate in the act of sex with me being open to life and him not being open to llife. I have to tell you I got alot of different answers from many different priests. So I called EWTN and a Catholic Family Land priests, Because I knew they followed the Church's teachings. They told me that my husband broke the bond of the marriage and it was not against church teaching to withold sex in that case in the marriage. I told him I would not cooperate, for I must be true to God first! I can not tell you how difficult that choice was for me. It was a risk, But I let go and let God. My husband relented, not happy about it at all! God blessed me with three more children. He came to love them all very much. Trusting God is very hard, sometimes it puts you into situations that seem very threating to one's way of life. It helped that I ran the Divine Mercy pray group at my church for a while, because He use this as my source of strength. My husband did later on get fixed behind my back. It was another crisies in our marriage, for I bellieve God wanted me to have a six child. It still pains me today. The marraige has not been easy, but we are still going. I know you are saying this is a cross for you, it was for me too. But in no way can you cooperate in that sin. It makes it almost impossible for God to work through Mortal sin. You have tied his hands, so to speak. You need to speak to some different priests, you can not rob from God which is rightfully his, YOUR future children. I know you think God has called you to this cross, but he did not call you to cooperate in in mortal sin, no matter what you tell yourself. It is a trick of the devil, we can NEVER cooperate in evil. I am sorry to say that. My husband is a good man, a good father but he never would of been if I had gone along with him. That is the truth. This thing about all children should be brought to life in love, As far as I am concern, they are. God loves each one of them! But they have to be born to Love him back. All of us are called to Love God first, that is why it is the first commandment. In the heart of Jesus's most merciful Heart, Mary

Gina,
Thank you for sharing and venting. I am in a somewhat similar situation, somwhat different. We have been married for 16 years and we have 4 children. Well, 7 children, but only 4 living. I recognize more children would be a gift from God, even if a burden to my present way of life. My husband has had enough children, but I long to build our family and please God.
Your thoughts and reconciliation with your situation are the same ones I have, and ponder on, and return to so very often. I think you are beautiful in God's eyes. He is loving you for your willingness to continue in spite of pain and conflict. I see you following his loving example of faithfulness, sacrifice, and love.
I learned a very long time ago that God's plan when two people join in marriage, is that each brings the other to salvation. I could not reach heaven without my husband, he will not reach it without me....we were created for eachother. Continue on your path, staying close to Jesus and Mary, and know that you are not the only one. Others suffer with you. The bigger picture is that we are working towards Heaven, and God's plan for us, individually, is unknown to anyone but Him. Continue to love Him, and John, and your present son, and all the children you find in your heart. Perhaps turn the love for children you never have, into prayer towards children that don't have parents to love them, or parents that find themselves with children they never wanted. God loves you and you are a beautiful example to all of us....whether we identify with you or not.

So is it birth control they are using? Or natural method? If birth control, how are you reconciling this with your Catholic faith. No judgement just wondering. I haven't been able to read everything.

Whoa there, Laurie~ I appreciate your intent to help, but your wording needs a bit of clarification. Natural Family Planning (which has been loudly lauded and touted by the Church) is emphatically NOT 'contraception'. "Contra" (meaning 'against') conception is the placing of barriers or engaging in acts (such as withdrawal, etc.) that impede conception. I'm not certain what you are calling the 'natual method' that you are equating with artificial contraception, but NFP is not at all contrary to the teachings of the Catholic faith.
There is an essential differance between engaging in the marital act during what is slated by science to be a woman's infertile time, and engaging in the use of artifical contraception. With NFP, the couple is still giving their total gift of self to each other, placing no barriers, and completing their act of love completely in accordance with natural and moral law. When a couple engages in the marital act during an infertile period, the man and woman are just as open to life through that act as if they were to engage in the act during a more fertile time. There is no barrier being raised to thwart conception; and God has blessed couples with the gift of children in times they have determined to be infertile. Spacing children through this method is a choice that requires a monthly reevaluation of a couple's belief in God's will for their particular family's life. It it between them, (the couple), the teachings of Holy Mother Church, and God.

Our late Holy Father JP II made a profound statement in his catechesis of Theology of the Body...that "the conjugal act means not only love, but also potential fruitfulness, and thus it cannot be deprived of its full and adequate meaning by means of artificial interventions. In the conjugal act, it is not licit to separate artificially the unitiive meaning from the procreative meaning, because the one as well as the other belong to the innermost truth of the conjugal act...When the conjugal act is deprived of its inner truth because it is deprived artificially of its procreative capacity, it also ceases to be an act of love." (from his Wednesday audience on Theology of the body August 22, 1984.) Now there is a rich teaching behind that statement. Theology of the Body was intended to be a full and complete foundation for the encyclical Humanae Vitae. It is the answer to cultural confusion about sexuality. It needs to widely spread about to all Catholics through the church but also to non-Catholic Christians who should not have any problem with it being it is wholly based on Scripture.

Hi Gina,

I also found you on Spirit Daily and rarely do I ever engage. . But I was compelled (I am sure the Holy Spirit had something to do with it) to share my thoughts.. First, I wholeheartely applaud you for living your faith through your marriage with authentic unconditional love. It is not the easy path-but the true and most rewarding. It is the Catholic view - and therefore the way of Christ in marriage-to ultimately put the final decision on all family matters in the hands of the husband who is head of his family. That does not mean a wife should not speak her mind from her heart and cannot disagree, nor accept any form of abuse. You said many times that you both communicate everything openly and so he fully knows how you feel. He bears the responsibility and also the burden of what comes from whatever decision he makes. If it were simply an act of selfishness, you would know. Since your husband is athiest-he cannot fully form his choices based on Christ teaching-so he forms it based on whatever he has learned and on the gifts he has received from God(even if he is unaware of it). He also has not the grace to fight his fears-and fear comes from the evil one-who is the father of lies and undoubtedly wants not to see your desire for bringing new life fullfilled. The battle is a spiritual one afterall. This is where unfortunately he can fail-or make the wrong choice-to the pain of the whole family-but obviously-is not his intent. To be honest, from what I have read in your dialogue, I have a hard time believing your husband is a true athiest-because the way he lives and loves shows Christs light in him more than one usually sees in someone who does not believe. He is maybe on his way-just doesn't know it yet;) Without that-knowing and trusting in the God who made him, he is unable perhaps to trust and wholeheartely accept whatever comes with the gift of another child-should God will it. I get the impression - based on his fears-your husband believes he is being protective as a father & husband and will stand by that-even if it separates you. What I see in your response is a witness to the trust you have in Gods ability to work through your love and patience in converting your husband. It is indeed the primary calling of every spouse to bring the other to Heaven. You seem to have found this to be more important than your deep wish for more children-and therefore a cross you are willing to bear. (willing to bear does not mean easy to bear-and letting it out this way may not only be good therapy for you-but for those who happen to read it.) God wants all of us to be open to life-this is what marriage was created for-.but as you said-you cannot force that acceptance of Gods Will-on someone else. It comes from God and your husband has to convert first. No doubt He put you together foremost for that purpose. God will never be outdone in generosity-so I also have no doubt what He has in mind for you and your family - be it more little ones or not-will be beyond your hopes and dreams. Marriage is a lifeling committment of authentic-sacrificail love that can only be fully realized with Christ as the foundation-for both. As they say "it takes three". Sacrificail love may be the way of the Cross, but the fruit is pure joy.
That is my prayer for you. That your husband has a deep conversion-very soon and this experience will not only bring you closer to each other but truly make you "one" in Christ.

Sarah - I have felt so often that maybe the way that God wants more children in my life is the way that you describe above. We have three boys and I wanted another for so long when my husband really didn't. Nevertheless, we were open and ended up miscarrying a little over two years ago. The pain is as real today as it was back then (tears flowing right now). I have had so much anxiety and guilt over my fear of getting pregnant again and losing the baby that I have often wondered if God wants us to adopt or take in other children. Thank you for your testimony - perhaps it was meant for me to read.

<3 this! Bless both of you. You'll be in my prayers. :)

I don't mean to judge, but only to point out some things to consider as you discern what to do in this situation. So bear with me.

Consider the following questions about your husband (and your own spirituality as well). Does your husband consider himself a faithful Catholic? Is he truly knowledgeable about what the church teaches - the Catechsim? Does your husband attend Mass every Sunday and confession regularly? Is he prayerful? Is he modeling, teaching, and sharing the faith with your son? Most important is this daily practice in your home as a couple, and as a family? If you answered "no" to any of these questions, your issue at hand is a spiritual one and I strongly urge you to seek out a priest, books, or a parish or diocesan program that focuses on Church teaching on Theology of the Body which encompasses the role of persons within a marriage, fidelity, our calling to children and contraception. Pope John Paul II wrote extensively on Theology of the Body. There are many good books out there on the subject (which expounds on the catechism regarding marriage) you can have him read. Simply googling the topic or even going to the EWTN website www.ewtn.com and clicking on the Q&A section with esteemed apologists, priests, and theologians who can help point you in the right direction and answer questions will help much.

I find that most people who truly know and understand their faith, would never choose to live in marriage with you. If he were a truly knowledgeable about the faith and if he is one considers himself to be seriously practicing his faith, he'd never put you in this position to begin with. I suspect in your case, with serious prayer, the assistance of a good spiritual director (preferrably a devout priest) and patience, your husband's hardened heart will be converted. If not, do not be afraid to leave this situation. In the end, the spiritual well-being of your souls is far more important than what a spouse can provide materially, financially or socially to you and your son. I'm not advocating divorce, but I am advocating choosing God and His will over our own. His will will always be for us to draw closer to Him than fearfully clinging to things familiar that in the end may harm us spiritually. Sometimes people don't convert until the things that matter to them most are almost lost forever. Just remember, your situation is a spiritual battle...not a battle of wills. Pray unceasingly for guidance and the soul and conversion of your husband, and most important, always put God and His will first.

Now back to my questions to consider. If your husband considers himself knowledgeable about the faith, does he truly realise that he is committing a grave mortal sin that must be confessed and that if he continues to live in this way, he could lose his eternal life. He is actively thwarting God's plan for your marriage by denying "God" (not your or your husband) the ability to choose whether you both will or will not have children? This is no less serious or different than the sins associated with homosexuality, mastrabation (selfish act of using non-life producing sex for self pleasure) using birth control or abortion (acts that prevent life) in the eyes of the Church. Because of this, the Church would deem this marriage invalid. For more on this get a copy of the Catechism of Catholic church or refer to Theology of the Body by Pope John Paul II as mentioned earlier.

It seems when people don't have full understanding of the gravity and implication of choices such as these they cling to these ideas. Not many people have a Church marriage knowingly wanting to defy church teaching, or knowingly wanting to hurt anyone. Sometimes when they read and better understand why these things are bad for us spiritually, we rethink our selfish ways and convert. I do believe this is really all you can do for your husband at this point....educate him, get him to someone who can educate him, and pray for his conversion. The ultimate choice to make this marriage to you a real marriage in the eyes of the church, to raise his son properly in the faith as God has intended, to know and live his faith, and ultimately have a true conversion, is all up to him.

The Church teaches that avoiding pregnancy without a valid reason (such as grave illness for instance) is a mortal sin (sins worthy of damnation) no different than choosing to use contraception or abortion. It also makes a marriage invalid in the eyes of the Church because he is not fulfilling the conditions the Church deems makes a valid marriage. If he takes his Catholic faith seriously, this should be downright sobering to him. And to add to that the thought that his actions could influence his son's view of marriage, fidelity, sex, and respect of church teaching in negative ways, thus setting the stage for him to live a less than desireable spiritual life should be all the more horrifying as he is called to raise his son "properly

I agree with what your saying in general, but if John was open to life in the beginning wouldn't their marriage already have been valid? I would like to see where the Church teaches this.Let me use an analogy. Marrying a person who is an alcoholic is one thing but if your husband/wife falls into alcoholism thats different. You then have the responsibility of helping that person get up right?

I'm posting this as a comment so all who have been following this thread are able to read it.

1 - I've swapped comments to Approve First. Courtesy of all the folks who have declared themselves Christ by judging my husband or I guilty of mortal sin, I feel compelled to remind people not to overstep their bounds. I am friendly with the delete button. You are not Christ, and you certainly cannot judge my soul (or that of my husband's). Even with the best of intentions.


2 - I must've gotten this phrase at least 20 times: "You might've answered this already, but I didn't read everything, so can you answer these questions again?"

I'm going to delete comments like this as well, because I'm not a broken record. If you're too lazy to read the responses I've already written 100 times, that's on you. I'm done reiterating myself.


3 - To those of you who have offered insightful differences of opinion, gentle words of compassion, prayers and well-wishes, I offer you my thanks. YOU are the type of people that make this conversation a worthwhile one. Bless you a thousand-fold for your spiritual generosity. I hope you continue to engage in this dialogue as I've learned much from you. Even if you have a different take on my approach, I appreciate you respectfully offering that difference without resorting to mortal sin accusations. Again - bless you.

Gina - you are a brave woman and I will add you to my prayer list. I cried at how faithful you have been and feel that the Lord will greatly reward you for that alone.

I find myself in a somewhat similar situation, though I am not up to writing all about it right now. Needless to say, I struggle with a big difference between me and my husband and pray for something to change in his heart. I also went years wanting another baby when my husband didn't feel we could handle it (even though he really wanted one). We were open to life and I got pregnant at 42 and miscarried. It devastated both of us, and now, I have had nothing but fear, anxiety and guilt about the situation every since.

I feel your sadness and am amazed at your strength and faithfulness. Perhaps, the Lord is using you as the means to your husband's eventual conversion to the faith. Without your example, he may never have been exposed to faithfulness like yours.

God bless you -

Very well written and from the heart. You know that Job too was mysteriously tested. He didn't understand why, but remained faithful and saw an increase in his family in the end. It's clear you are filled with a lot of love and you are greatly loved by Our Lord. Peace and God be with you and your family.

I read the whole article and all the comments. But I have one question which has not be directly asked or answered. Why doesn't your husband want to use NFP? NFP today (especially using the Fertility Monitor device) is extremely accurate. So if your husband has good reasons to avoid pregnancy you just have relations during infertile times. True, you still won't get anymore kids but at least you can fully unite as husband and wife with the sex act itself still being open to life as you both promised to be at your marriage. no worrying about sin. Yes, your husband would have to make the very small sacrifice of abstaining some days every month (which is not anywhere equal to your sacrifice) but it seems if he truly loves you he could do that for you. Have you discussed NFP and if so what are his objections to it?

As I read your post I was so heartbroken for you, and you expressed your pain so well that it is almost palpable. It seems you are trying to convey that even though you are often unintentionally confronted with the reminder of what you do not have and will probably never have but desire with all your heart, you must often suffer in silence out of charity for others, but that you understand your situation as a sacrifice of love. I do not know how old you are, but because of some of the ways you express yourself you sound relatively young, perhaps in your late 20’s or early 30’s. I am in my late 50’s and never married and have no children, though I desired both very much my whole life. I wanted to marry someone who wanted children, and I never met that man. So I did not marry. As I grew older and realized I was not going to have children, I often felt the pain you so aptly describe, in the same sorts of situations. I am now in menopause and I will never have what I wanted. So I can grasp what you are saying. I know this is not the same situation as yours, but I want to say something to you about your idea of sacrificing your desire for more children as an act of love for your husband. You mention that “Maybe this is the cross Christ is asking me to bear.” Maybe it is, for today or for a little while. But here’s my advice to you. Say “no” in your spirit. Say no, and mean no, that you will not accept only one child unless God wants that for you. Then you go to Our Lady and you beg her, you plead, you nag, you whine, you cry and you tell her you want ALL the kids God wants you to have, and you tell her to ask Jesus to soften your husband’s heart, that you respect him as your head, and you will obey him, but his desire for no more kids is not okay with you and you want God’s will to be done in your lives. Promise Our Lady you will dedicate your children to her, that you will name them after her (even the boys, somehow!). Pray to St. Elizabeth, who gave up on having a child, but didn't stop praying for one and was blessed with St. John the Baptist in her old age. Tell her to you need help, ask her to pray for you. Ask these two holy women to conspire to get you your kids. Do this as often as you think of this problem, every day, several times a day if you think of it, for years if you have to, until you get the peace you are seeking, and an answer from God. You don’t have to mention this to your husband or even try to change his mind, but here’s the thing. If God only wants little Vincent for you, you will come to understand this is okay and you will find peace. If God wants more kids for you , and you show Him how great is your desire, He will find a way where there seems to be no way. And what will happen is your own faith will increase, and you will find joy, not pain, in your situation. Don’t just sit there…PETITION! For goodness sake, GO TO GOD WITH YOUR PROBLEM! In my life, because of my prayers, I accept my childlessness, but I STILL HAVE HOPE. I know it is ridiculous, but I still hope in some crazy way God will give me what I desire. It’s impossible, but I don’t care. And if a miracle ever happens for me, I’ll let you know. 

All I read here was love...true love. The kind that we gaze upon on the Crucifix. And I KNOW that with God all things are possible. And It's preciesly because of your Christian love for your husband that his heart will be flooded with graces through your prayers. I feel so blessed to have read this post. Marriage is so multi-faceted...so many layers, so many unique and at times difficult peculiarities. I have been married for 32 years and have six children. Although it's a different story than yours in so many ways, my marriage is strong because of the very same love you describe in your post for perhaps opposite reasons. But the result is the same. Love wins. Love conquers. Sacrifice is the face of love. Love has a name: Jesus...and He showed us what love looks like. It's as near as the closest Tabernacle and Crucifix. God bless you. Continue to love. Love wins.

You clearly need a miracle, so here's how to get them: Read about the green scapular; get one blessed for your husband, stuff it under his side of the matress, and say the little inscription on it every day.

Next, make one or both these Novenas: "Our Lady Undoer of Knots" and / or the 54-day Rosary Novena. The latter is very hard to complete; because you will only be able to sustain this prayer campaign if it is truly God's will for you to have your request.

Lastly, fasting makes your prayer far more powerful. There are many prudent ways to fast (not diet) listed on Christian or Catholic webpages.

Google all these topics to educate yourself, then plan a resolute prayer campaign. I guarantee that when you complete the novenas you will have a successful pregnancy; perhaps God will even give you twins to make up for lost time !

Oh, and I cannot recommend too highly persuading your husband next vacation to take you both to Mejugorie. Trust Our Lady to deal with him there without need for you to say anything to him at all-- even if he doesn't want to walk with you anywhere there -- she'll find him in whatever hotel or guest house he's relaxing in . . . ;-)

Amen! :) He was wonderful to my son, Vince, while I was pregnant. I'm so happy you had a happy ending, yourself. Bless you.

You and your family will be in my prayers. I have learned to pray for God's will in all things. Not what I think should happen, nor what anyone else thinks should happen, but truly for the grace to accept all the good and bad in my life as God's will. I admire your sacrifice, and I pray that God's will is accomplished in your marriage. As I often tell my kids when they're going through a hard time, offer it up, God will do something great with your sacrifice. His ways are not our ways and He can bring good out of anything! May God give you his peace.

I haven't had time to read the overwhelming number of posts. However, I really sympathize with your grief, your intense desire to have more children that you've always dreamed of and your husband's conflicting desire to have no more. This is a STRUGGLE especially for you. You don't need therapy, for goodness' sake for obvious reasons you've stated. I find it actually amazing that you don't resent him. I wanted more children (we have 3) and finally I became pregnant and my husband was sooooo angry with me. We had a car accident and I lost the baby and to be honest, I resented him because he was driving too fast and I really think I miscarried because of the accident. He also doesn't agree with NFP but is going along with it somewhat resentfully. But, he's not as angry about it as he used to be. I have ached to hold more children or at least another child in my arms. And I never used to dream of having children as a child. Whatever, you have made yourself extremely vulnerable. I commend you for your openness. I couldn't quite tell but I'm guessing your husband is Catholic. I'm assuming here that you know all about the Theology of the Body. And being that you two are so open with your emotions and interests, thoughts, etc. have you ever thought of sharing parts of a CD with him that really speaks to you- if you own any TOB CD's or any passages of books about this topic with him-if you own any books. Or, is this whole situation too fragile to read him something like this? On the other hand, it sounds like he was previously open to having more children and things changed along the way. (Of course, a change of beliefs or opinions AFTER marriage is not grounds for an annulment, whatever people are saying). If I remember correctly from a post that you said his thoughts about not having more children involve some fear. Fear of not providing. Fear you may not have enough love to give around (does he know how much love you have in your heart waiting to give away? Painful). Have you talked with him about some of his fears? Maybe you can pray for his faith to increase. With an increase in faith and trust in Our Lord, perhaps his viewpoints about things may change. I don't know. My husband has actually brought up a vasectomy. That scared me and still does though he hasn't brought it up recently. I, however, am prone to resentment. It's not huge, but it's there. How do you NOT resent him for denying you more lives and souls to bring into this world? Let me know how you do not resent him. Right now, I have health issues that will not be resolved soon. So, having children wouldn't be wise right now.
I deeply feel for you and sympathize for your unfulfilled desire. To desire to bring forth life is to desire to share in God's creative power. This is one of the greatest if not the greatest power on earth. And your desire is so counter-cultural today. Have you prayed for your husband's conversion of heart? Maybe this is something to do and keep doing? Don't know....I will think of and pray for you.

Dear Gina
Thank you for writing this. I had not seen ONE posting on this subject before.
You are not alone. My case is a bit different. I had post-partum depression when I had my baby.
Dark times; times which my husband does not wish to see again.
So he has decided we are not having any more children.
I am heart broken, but I understand him.
May God help us through this, Gina... there are nights when I wake up and I panic - I am almost 40 and it may just be too late for a second child, or third.
It helps me know that I am not alone in this.
So thank you again. May the Lord bless you.

Yes, you're right, Gina. Your emotions and suffering are a lot like those of us who are physically infertile. The sorrow and pain comes back to me readily, even bringing tears to my eyes as I empathize with you completely, but 32 years ago the Lord blessed us with an adopted child--it took just 6 months from application to him being in our home, less than a pregnancy. They told it it would take at least three years for us to be able to adopt. God's perfect miracle and perfect timing. I wanted more children, my husband did not. God took care of that. No, we did not adopt any more children, but God gave me such a peace about it, that I knew He knew me and our family's needs better than we did ourselves. My prayer in all circumstances is, "Lord, if you do not want this for me, please take the desire away." He has been faithful in this prayer in huge and small ways. I know our son was supposed to be in our family, and I also know that he needed to be an only child. God does not make mistakes, and He is in total control. The desires of your heart will be met by God in His Way, His time. I don't know if that involves more children for you or not, but I do know that the suffering and pain you offer up to God are more powerful than the greatest need to bear children. I am fiercely pro-life and I am asking that you offer it up for an end to the slaughter of babies in their mothers' wombs. And I ask St. Joseph to intercede powerfully 24/7 before the Throne of Jesus for you and you husband and your child. He is the perfect go-to Saint for all things, especially husbands, marriages, and families. God is doing what needs to be done. I feel a great peace for you and your husband. We thank God for what He has already done, what He is doing now, and for He is yet to do in your family. God bless you!

To Gina:
I am sending this as a blog comment, but it's really a letter for you. If you find anything interesting, of course feel free to publish it on your blog. Just, know I don't expect it. I am not a native speaker of English. Although my academic English is excellent, sometimes I have trouble with tone. I try so hard to be exact when conveying meaning that I end up sounding dry, self-absorbed or harsh. I really hope it's not what comes across -- I worked really hard on this letter! Still, if there is any such problem, please read with an understanding ear.


Peace be upon your heart.
I stumbled on your blog while on a completely random hunt, originally on chapel veils. I read your entry on purifiers and loved it [I too will never look at a priest cleaning the chalice the same way again, with heartfelt thanks to you]. Your writing had spiritual depth, of a type I recognize and hunger for. I thought I'd check out one more of your top-rated entries and see what other tasty things are on the menu. Next thing I knew, I found myself in a painful and very detailed emotional landscape of want and denial. Next came a LONG list of comments.
<smile of satisfaction for making it through them all>

You write powerfully. It's good for the soul to read about *real* choices, those that are hard because you desperately want the answer to be different from what you know to be right. I can't relate in terms of wanting kids as strongly as you do (32 year old female still trying to find a good match as a husband), but I can relate in terms of sheer emotional pain.

You convinced me that you're doing the right thing when it became apparent in your comments that you and your husband are not having communication issues whatsoever. You receive each other as fully as you can, compatibly with your mindset; you're both trying to do what's right. If things were not so, maybe there'd be room to "stand up and push/fight". But things are so, and the only thing you can do is bear the wait as graciously as possible. I commend you for how graciously you have been bearing it.
Maybe there's a wee li'l bit of room for improvement, if it were possible to gently nudge your husband in the direction of NFP instead of condoms. Even using condoms while practicing NFP is better than giving NFP up and just accepting condoms in your life. Of course, only you know if this objective can be pursued. If you can, you get the special bonus points of saving your husband from something extra to expiate, either here or in Purgatory.

I'd like to spend a few words on a perspective I have not seen mentioned in the comments. I think your battle is a battle of faith. Of course, to some extent all battles are battles of faith, but this one is, from my point of view, *fundamentally* a battle of faith. It's just so emotionally heavy that sustaining the pain drains all the clarity and one ends up losing sight of exactly which question is the real battleground.
It seems to me that you are not one bit lacking faith in God in general, nor in his Will being always to your benefit, nor in many other aspects of trust that most catholics have huge problems with. I think that you have yet to make a definitive choice on how you want to interpret what God has been telling you for years. Until you do that, the enemy can use it to torture your heart.

God has given you, from a very early age, the acute awareness that you would have children. You have been preparing for them for a long time. You write to them in your diary. You make room for them in your life. You evaluate your choices in the light of their future presence. Please let not the super-secularized world we're living in convince you that these were just childhood fantasies.
They are not. They are a promise, a precognition of what is to come. He's been preparing you, growing you into a mama every day more. God wrote this in your heart. The question is: do you believe His promise? Can you have the patient unshakable faith of Abraham?

"I am the mother of children I'll never meet", you say ."I will never have the family I'd always envisioned" -- this is despair of the mind. It's what happens when we believe a lie. It hurts like crazy -- because it is a lie, not because it is the truth. Strange and beautiful how that works, eh?

God has given you the most amazing reassurance YEARS in advance of this cross. There *will* be children after your first. Of course there will be children, because God is faithful. He didn't send you inspirations just to come up with a way to make the lack of kids weigh on your soul even more. He sent you inspirations to teach you to think of yourself as a mother, to impress this calling upon your soul and to do so early on, before the enemy could come in and do his best to spoil the picture. He did it so that you could find comfort, holding this as surety in your heart, in the times of trial.

The enemy is very active in twisting hearts into raw pain. To exasperate the suffer